Better Binary provider?

This is a discussion on Better Binary provider? within the Fixed Odds & Binary Betting forums, part of the Markets category; I agree, the 1 touch / no touch spreads are a little wider than a few of the other vendors ...

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Old Apr 24, 2007, 9:55am   #17
Joined Dec 2006
I agree, the 1 touch / no touch spreads are a little wider than a few of the other vendors but they give you 100% control. You set your own barrier level and expiry time. Most of the others offer just one or a few expiry times which would never suit my trading agenda. I need FULL customisation and these guys offer that with bells on.

So many of their bets are unique and not offered by anyone else that I can structure multi-bet payoff profiles to perfectly reflect my market view in a way that I couldn't come close to doing with the others. Take ChoiceOdds for example, they only offer a few intraday strikes on about half a dozen markets and their only boast is that they quote the same product using two methods, fixed-odds and binary. BetsForTraders offer that bet type quoted in about 5 different ways. Big deal - it is still just a binary however you polish it.

Hedging a portfolio of risk is no more difficult for someone with millions of bets on offer than for the smaller guys with just a few. All the greeks can be amalgamated, grouped and the net exposures on different assets can be hedged by their order (delta, gamma, vega and so on). In any event I don't really care about their hedging methods.

I have just placed my 400th bet on the BetsForTraders beta site and am up 935% on my money as of now. I have also only had (yes, I record them) 6 bets rejected in volatile markets. That is 1.5%. The dealing interface, the product range and the flexibility make these guys the best 'over the counter' provider there is. I just wish they would hurry up and go live. I have written a programme which scans for arbs between them and binarybet and they come up several times a day.

As an aside, I have started systematically quoting prices both sides of the (very wide) spread on Intrade using my own models for their binary bets. Although BetsForTraders are quite obviously the best OTC bookie I am still married to the Intrade concept. Well worth a look.

Just my 2c.

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Old Apr 24, 2007, 11:09am   #18
Joined Apr 2007
Originally Posted by NotQuiteRandom
I have just placed my 400th bet on the BetsForTraders beta site and am up 935% on my money as of now. NQR
1) There you have the very reason why they won't go live - their prices are rubbish.
2) You have also just fast tracked yourself to having your account closed as soon as they go live.
3) They can afford not to reject anything when there is no real money at stake.
4) You should care how they can hedge (which they can't if no one else offers their products) because unless they have someone filling both sides of a bet they are taking a risk which means that if you win, they lose - so they might start rejecting more bets or close you down.

Betsfortraders might work in an academic bubble, with lots of clients and a perfect pricing model but in the real world i think it is giong to fall very very flat.
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 11:23am   #19
Joined Dec 2006
HappyArber, in response to your points:

1) Their prices are not far off fair value when running a monte carlo or feeding market implied vols & other parameters into a closed form approximation. Having a background in financial maths this was the first thing I tried. Note also that this applies to Binary bet and BOM, they are all pretty close.

2) According to their help desk they hedge and their hedging error is mandated at a maximum term under their corporate charter and supervised by their auditors. I can figure out how they do so but am really not interested beyond what I have learned. I have been assured that they do not make a loss from my gains and know this to be a perfect mathematical possibility. Call them for more information, they are very helpful.

3) I agree - we will have to monitor this when they go live.

I am doing an increasing amount of my trading and hedging using binary bets and am delighted that another serious player is entering the market. There is a real lack of product out there with only one other letting you have a decent choice as to expiry time and other parameters.

After reading your very minor contributions to this forum which only serve to knock Ladbrokes and BetsForTraders I can only assume that you are a pathetic plant by one of the other binary providers. Go home and leave this forum for traders to discuss interesting developments in the binary market place on their own. Shame on you!
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 11:32am   #20
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Joined Apr 2007
For me the is the preferred one. It has the only timeswitch bets and so much other bets that the less good small company of choiceodds and ladbrokes does not to have. Those last 2 have same software I think or they do copy eachother with not very much to offer I think.

I am beta tester for and they have given me 100 euro when they go live as gift to so much beta testing. I do not do the maths but I do bet and cfd trade for 4 years of full time with technical analysis method from points and figure. I want to see that prices stay same after the live date for them so I can trade for my money. If they do, good, if do not, that is fine, I will not be customer. Their email says it is same so I hope so because so far my beta profit has enough for my new moterbike ;-)
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 11:43am   #21
Joined Dec 2006
100 euro? Hahaha, I am up to 250 quid. Not sure how they formulate the system but I think that you earn more real money for when they go live by doing more beta testing. Also, I have emailed them about 30 times with ideas, questions and comments. I told them that they should do a virtual tour and offer some other features which they are now doing.

I was also one of the participants who voted for as the name when they sent out that first email. The interactive element of their client services is good.
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 12:00pm   #22
Joined Apr 2007
A plant?!?! give over - surely no one would bother with that - unless you know different NQR? Come to think of it, background in financial maths? and you seem to know a lot about how BetsforTraders works. oh and you were bigging up the amount of money you made with them. hmm? i might start taking what you say with a pich of salt.

i've been with BB pretty much since the start and i welcome all new commers. some r definitally better than others tho. they all have some drawbacks tho. i'm just glad there are some new ones who have come up with better platforms. Time will tell which ones have the best site and model. innovation is a good thing for sure tho and new products, durations etc.

Plus more there are the more arbs there are likely to be!
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Old Apr 24, 2007, 12:22pm   #23
Joined Dec 2006
HappyArber, I look forward to reading your next post knocking the next competitor that worries you. Ladbrokes, then BetsForTraders, by Friday you could beat up BOM, BinaryBet, Intrade and the others if you get to work now.

If I say so myself, I do know a fair bit about the operators in the binary betting space. So you would you if you traded full time for a living. You will note that I have also commented on the other operators which I have made good money through, especially my favourite of all, Intrade.

Times must be tough at the company you obviously work for if you are reduced to being rude about you competitors on forums. I don't see the others doing that here.

Anyway, you get back to work before you become any more tedious while I kill time waiting to close another trade. When you come back with a different username to post another dozen or so times about how great one company is and how bad the others are, don't forget to obfuscate your IP address from the moderators or your cover will be blown! Just a tip.

We are no longer adding value to this forum with this conversation so I suggest immediate termination.


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Old Apr 24, 2007, 12:46pm   #24
Joined Nov 2003
I can't agree re IG Index seeking to sucker people into betting spreads by allowing them to play with binaries. Two things: first, there is a large group of traders, of whom I'm one, who have no interest in spreads - if binaries were withdrawn from the market I'd look at CFDs, but not spreads; second, IG Index makes money from binaries - 90% of its players lose money, and each of them provides the company with two grand per year in profit. IG Index is not going to let that kind of money go, on the off chance that binary players would switch to spreads. if you doubt this, ask yourself why IG Index is focussing on pushing binaries to the Asian market. If you still question whether there is money to be made in binary betting - and that it's not a loss leader - ask yourself why other companies are moving into the market, i.e. ChoiceOdds and BetsForTraders. Finally, BetOnMarkets has been ploughing the binary betting field for going on five years now, and I've never heard any suggestion that they're losing money.

I agree with you about BetsForTraders offering a wider range of opportunities. I've been making a living from binaries - binarybet and extrabet - for going on two years now and I've done that by developing one strategy and sticking to it. I think the same thing can be achieved with BetsForTraders. By the way, I've spoken to them about being able to sell a position before expiry time, and they hope to introduce the facility either at the same time they go 'live' or shortly after. This can only increase the possibility to profit from a properly structured bet.

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